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Author Topic: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order  (Read 29602 times)

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djkimmel

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Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« on: December 18, 2005, 05:49:05 PM »

Here is the actual MDNR Fisheries Order language making drop-shotting now legal in Michigan on most waters including all the Great Lakes and all inland lakes except the named drowned river mouths off Lake Michigan. Drop-shotting is not legal in inland streams or rivers. Read the language carefully to understand where we are at.

Thanks for the MDNR Fisheries and Law Divisions for their willingness to rewrite these regulations so that law-abiding anglers an enjoy a successful and nationally recognized technique. Several fisheries biologists went out of their way to come up with this language acceptable to all parties. I don't want to leave anyone out, but Gary Towns and Jeff Braunscheidel in particular did a great job on this rewrite.

====
                                                                                FO-218.06
                              ORDER
_________________________________________ ________________

                              (Under the authority of Act 451 of the
                              Public Acts of 1994, as amended)

                              GEAR RESTRICTIONS FOR FISHING

Under the authority of sections 41101 through 41105 of Act 451 of the Public Acts of 1994, as amended, being section 324.41101 through 324.41105 of the Michigan Compiled Laws, the Director of the Department of Natural Resources on October 6, 2005, order that:


A) In all waters of the State it shall be unlawful to:

          1.  Have a weight permanently and/or rigidly attached to a
               multi-pointed hook; or

          2.  Have a weight suspended from a multi-pointed hook; or

          3.  Retain any fish not hooked in the mouth; or

          4.  Fail to immediately return to the water a fish not hooked in
               the mouth.


B) On all streams, including tributaries to the Great Lakes except for the St. Marys, St. Clair and Detroit Rivers, it shall be unlawful to use the following gear during the period August 1 - May 31:

          1.  Multi-pointed hooks exceeding 3/8 inch between point and
               shank and/or single pointed hooks exceeding 1/2 inch
               between point and shank; or

          2.  Lures exceeding one ounce in weight.

The intent of this regulation is to allow the baited hook or the lure to suspend freely in the water, allowing the fish to take the hook or lure in its mouth.


C) In a river, stream, and drowned river mouth lake* it shall be unlawful to:

          1.  Have a weight suspended below any hook unless the hook
               is on an un-weighted line which is at least 3 inches long.


*Drowned river mouth lakes listed by county: Allegan: Kalamazoo River and Silver Lake; Benzie: Betsie Lake; Manistee: Arcadia Lake, Manistee Lake, and Portage Lake; Mason: Pere Marquette Lake; Muskegon: Duck Lake, Mona Lake, Muskegon Lake, and White Lake; Oceana: Pentwater Lake, Silver Lake, and Stony Creek; Ottawa: Macatawa Lake and Pigeon Lake.


This order is assigned FO-218.06 and is titled "Gear Restrictions for Fishing".

This order supersedes the order entitled ?Gear Restrictions for Fishing? effective September 29, 2002, and assigned number FO-218-02A.

This order shall take effect on April 1, 2006, and shall remain effective through March 31, 2011.

Issued on the 6th day of October 2005.

                                                (signed)
                                                Rebecca A. Humphries
                                                Director


The Natural Resources Commission has reviewed this order.

(signed)                                    (signed)
Keith J. Charters                        Teresa Gloden
Chairperson                               Executive Secretary
« Last Edit: June 29, 2010, 11:54:54 AM by djkimmel »
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djkimmel

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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - Update/Clarifications
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2006, 11:41:54 PM »

I have some important clarifications from the MDNR Law Division - Sgt. Jackie Waber from the Regulations, Policy and Technology Section in Lansing in cooperation with Fisheries Division. I asked for some interpretation on the west side that various anglers were asking me about.

Here's what we have from the MDNR (MDNR decisions in red) on our new 2006 drop shot regulations (effective 4/1/06):

1)? Because Bear Lake is a lake, drop-shotting will be lawful after 4/1/06.? ?djk: This is Bear Lake off Muskegon Lake in Muskegon county. Drop-shotting not legal in Muskegon Lake, but legal in Bear Lake.

2)? The above answer applies to Spring Lake as well.? Although these bodies of water are "connected" to a river, they are not considered to be a "part" of the river.? ?djk: This is Spring Lake off the Grand River, Ottawa County.

3)? This is a little more difficult for me to answer without actually seeing these "bayous" but I believe them to be part of the river system and therefore drop-shotting would be prohibited in these bodies of water.? djk: This is regarding all the smaller bayous off of the Grand River, Ottawa County - Stearns, Pottowatomie, Dermo, Millhouse, Lloyds, Bruces, Robinsons - Because these are not distinctly accepted lakes this is the decision I expected.

4)? The gravel pit is considered part of the river system and therefore drop-shotting would be prohibited there as well.? ?djk: This is the large gravel pit at the end of the marked channel of the Grand River - Ottawa County. The same would apply for the smaller gravel pit back towards Bruces.

From Sgt. Waber: As you know, this new regulation will be interpreted differently by many individuals and I appreciate this opportunity to explain Law Enforcement and Fisheries Divsions' interpretation. If you have any additional questions, please let me know.

Thanks to the MDNR Law Enforcement and Fisheries Divisions for clarifying these issues for us in a timely and very helpful manner. I will be posting this information on other sites over the weekend and sending out an update to the various tournament groups so they can be on top of regulations when their members ask.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2006, 04:16:12 PM by djkimmel »
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DAWGFishin

Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2014, 08:12:54 AM »

Can someone clarify if this is still in affect? This fall at the All Star tournament in Muskegon the DNR told everyone that a Drop Shot is illegal in Michigan. I realize reading the directive that would be true for Muskegon and White Lakes.

I'd help trying to get that changed if is correct. Drop Shotting is a great method and should be allowed in all water as long as the intent isn't to snag.
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t-bone

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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2014, 09:23:06 AM »

I believe it still is in effect -it was legalized only for inland lakes, the Great Lakes and connecting waters, including the Detroit River, St. Clair River and Lake St. Clair. Drop shotting is still illegal in rivers and drowned river mouths.
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gmetime24

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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2014, 05:10:41 PM »

What about river systems that are darned up and now resevoirs?? We have many lakes in our
Area that are rivers on the north end..is dropshot legal in these areas??
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mikesmiph

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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2014, 05:32:00 PM »

It was my understanding that law only applied to the west side of the state where they have salmon runs. I may be wrong.
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gmetime24

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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2014, 10:26:45 PM »

It was my understanding that law only applied to the west side of the state where they have salmon runs. I may be wrong.

After doing a good amount of research I think you are correct. All rivers and stream are off limits but some inland lakes on the west side are illegal to drop shot as well. I found one page that listed Portage lake in manistee county as an illegal place to drop shot. Why is this lake on the list?? I thought it was drowned river mouth inland waters?? Here is the link

http://www.michiganbass.net/Web%20Pages/Conservation_page.htm
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TheFishinPollock

Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2014, 07:09:27 AM »

So basicly, as im understanding it, nothing actually changed. Downriver mouths are still illegal to do so in.
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williamonica0214

Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #8 on: February 10, 2014, 08:07:08 AM »

So you can drop shot with a single pointed hook ?
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djkimmel

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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #9 on: February 10, 2014, 09:32:27 PM »

Please read the first post in this thread. That is the exact regulation still effective since April 1, 2006. The initial order was for 5 years. It was re-issued for another 5 years effective when the initial 5 years expired.

It is common for these types of orders to be set for 5 year periods, and then to be re-issued every 5 years until or unless something or someone else changes them.

I have posted some follow up clarifications in this same thread that have come up to questions asked by persons in the past.

In general, you can't use a normal drop shot rig in any inland river in Michigan. Nor can you use it in the specific drowned river mouths listed in the order above. The St. Mary's, St. Clair and Detroit Rivers are not inland rivers, but defined as part of the Great Lakes Connecting Waters so you can drop shot the normal way in them. It's all there. You can use a hook/lure above your weight in these places in most cases IF you use at least a 3" dropper line from the main line to your hook/lure. Other laws and regulations may apply of course.

If you're in a lake/reservoir, commonly known as a lake/reservoir, than you aren't in a river. You should be okay BUT... it is everyone's individual responsibility to read and be familiar with a laws and regulations. My recommendation is always, when in doubt, contact the MDNR Law Enforcement Division and ask. It would not hurt at all for more anglers to get more familiar with more MDNR persons (and vice versa).

There can be exceptions. Especially, be aware you may get different answers from a local Conservation Officer verses the public division spokesperson in Lansing. There can be 'pretty sure' but not always '100% guaranteed.' We will have 30+ new CO's coming onboard over the next year or so. I expect a little addition to the local vs. Lansing differences.

You could print the first post in the this thread and keep it with you since it is the actual regulation in the books. I'm not aware of any changes. I have not had any time to work on this, but anyone could choose to do so. One or two persons can make a difference. I generally do not support regulations where the main or sole purpose is to make law enforcement easier at the expense of the majority good anglers and hunters. I believe it is the wrong way to manage our natural resources effectively - way more harm to the good side than impact on the negative side. That's my opinion.
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djkimmel

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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2014, 09:35:46 PM »

So you can drop shot with a single pointed hook ?


Your question is too broad to answer simply. Please read the regulation in the first post of this thread, and the follow up clarifications. There are hook size restrictions, hook type restrictions and location restrictions involved depending upon where you are fishing. It may seem confusing but that's what happens when restrictive regulations are used too often, and regulating bodies try to restrict activities with broad gear restrictions that affect too many non-bad anglers. I'm trying to change that way of thinking, but as always, change is scary and hard for lots of people...
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djkimmel

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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2014, 09:38:16 PM »

So basicly, as im understanding it, nothing actually changed. Downriver mouths are still illegal to do so in.

Nothing has changed that I'm aware of. Make sure you are only including the LISTED drowned river mouth lakes in the actual regulation. There are some where it is legal to drop shot using the traditional, real drop shot (without the 3 inch or longer main line to hook drop line).
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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2014, 09:40:20 PM »

I did not see or hear what the MDNR
It was my understanding that law only applied to the west side of the state where they have salmon runs. I may be wrong.

Yup - you're wrong. ;D Read the regulation in the first post. It includes all inland rivers and only the listed 'drowned river mouth' lakes.
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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2014, 09:53:22 PM »

Can someone clarify if this is still in affect? This fall at the All Star tournament in Muskegon the DNR told everyone that a Drop Shot is illegal in Michigan. I realize reading the directive that would be true for Muskegon and White Lakes.

I'd help trying to get that changed if is correct. Drop Shotting is a great method and should be allowed in all water as long as the intent isn't to snag.


I didn't see or hear exactly who told the anglers what at that tournament, but it is illegal to use the traditional drop shot in both Muskegon and White Lakes (listed drowned river mouth lakes), and the inland rivers (all inland Michigan rivers) flowing into those lakes. You can 'drop shot' if you use a 3 inch or longer dropper line from your main line to your hook/bait. I was told by the MDNR Law Enforcement Division spokesperson in Lansing from a previous clarification that Bear Lake (off of Muskegon Lake) would be legal to drop shot.

Since I was not involved in the angler briefing, nor was I consulted on this issue I don't know if that was spelled out correctly or at all. Sometimes the major tournament groups will also make decisions that are tougher than local regulations to simplify the rules for all anglers visiting an unfamiliar area so B.A.S.S. may not have wanted to discuss the Bear Lake exception even if they were aware of it. I don't know if anyone went into Bear Lake, or if that was addressed in any way?

Drop shotting is legal in Michigan in more places than it is illegal. It can be done with a dropper line almost everywhere. You still have to be aware of other hook size restrictions, particularly on trout/salmon waters. Some of those waters, or even parts of open waters in a few cases (Manistee Lake) are completely closed to ALL fishing for part of the year. Know those regulations. Everyone needs to.

I agree with your sentiment that drop shotting should not be restricted the way it is just to make law enforcement easier. Some other outdoor groups don't feel the same way. Some MDNR don't feel that way. I have been in meetings with one MDNR CO though who consistently states publicly that he doesn't think regulations should be made just to make law enforcement easier.

There's always room for someone to come in and try to achieve change and improvement. As good as things are hear, we have plenty of room for improvement still. Be aware that once again, the MDNR is stating they will go to a 2-year printed fishing regulations book, which means regulations changes will take longer than before.

I don't know if they will actually go to the 2-year book this time or not. They've been saying they are going to do it for a long time. I'm thinking with their recent license fee structure change that they may actually do it this time. I don't like it personally. But I'm one person. One person can make a difference but it's smart to pick and choose wisely, and not try to fix everything at the same time.
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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #14 on: July 29, 2014, 01:57:50 PM »

So you can use a perch rig, the line just must be 3inches?
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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #15 on: July 31, 2014, 03:00:21 PM »

The line from the main line above your weight (includes a lure used as weight) to your hook must be at least 3 inches long.
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Bassomatic

Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #16 on: September 24, 2018, 11:27:15 AM »

Dan, I had exchanged emails with you about this regulation possibly being relaxed even more to allow more dropshotting opportunities?  When you receive info with regard to this will you post it here?  Looking for info as to when/where meeting will be held to discuss this with our DNR folks.  Thanks!
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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #17 on: September 24, 2018, 12:29:49 PM »

Ahhh  I remember the Dark Days talking drop shotting in Smokey pool rooms and bars.   I used to fish it before it was legal.   My fishing buddy was scared to death we were going to get arrested. 
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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #18 on: September 26, 2018, 05:24:11 PM »

Yes, Chief Jim Dexter called me in late August saying they were writing up new regulations that would remove the restriction on drop shotting from the West Michigan drowned river mouths. I have not seen the actual language yet but it sounds gear-based so I'm not fully sure yet how it will work and if it has any effect on inland rivers which are also restricted. Dexter wasn't sure at the time either.

I need to check the michigan.gov/nrc website to see if they've uploaded the October meeting agenda yet with a copy of the proposed regulations change in it. The MDNR Fisheries Division plan is to present the new regulations at the October NRC meeting for information only. That would be the place to either submit written support or come to speak in favor of the change.

I plan on being there to do that. That NRC meeting is Thursday, October 11 at the MSU Diagnostic Center, 4125 Beaumont Road, Lansing, MI 48910. They have a conference room there just inside the building.

Fisheries usually presents their updates around 1 PM to the NRC fisheries committee commissioners. Public speaking starts at the end of the full NRC meeting which can be anywhere from ~4 PM to 5:30 PM. Those are just estimates. The agenda and pace can change the timing.

To speak you need to sign up either at the meeting before the end, or by email before the meeting. If you sign up to speak by the Friday before the meeting (October 5) you can have up to 5 minutes to speak. If you sign up at the meeting you get 3 minutes. You are timed. Sometimes there are lots of speakers so the later you sign up the longer you wait to get to your turn.

You can sign up before by emailing the Executive Assistant Cheryl Nelson (you can also call 517-284-6237) at nrc@michigan.gov. That is the email address you would also send any written comments to. Go to michigan.gov/nrc to see meeting information, agendas and minutes.
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Re: Dropshot legal in Michigan for 2006 - MDNR Fisheries Order
« Reply #19 on: September 26, 2018, 05:27:05 PM »

I just checked and the October agenda is still not posted.
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