I have a 99 TR20 with a Merc 200, 6" manual jackplate, and a 25P Trophy prop. People with the same exact setup on BBC state they are running low 70's. My motor has a fresh rebuild with 7 hours on it so I might be jumping the gun here. After 5 hours, the mechanic told me I could open it up for 2-3 second bursts. When I did this, the top speed I can get to is 56 mph at 5500 rpm. I am running 100:1 oil mixture on top of what the oil injectors are pumping for the break in period of 10 hours.
To me it seems I would at least get up to something close to 70. Any ideas?
I know that boat and when you get the motor broken in you should be high 60's with dialed in just right 70. But wait till it's broken in......don't worry about speed yet. Oh, and don't forget ethanol additive....
That is what I was thinking but was beginning to wonder. A few more trips out and she should be broken in. I just put the last of the 100:1 oil/fuel mix in. The reason for the rebuild was due to the gas line inner falling apart and getting into the motor. What kind of Ethanol Additive do you all use?
I'm sure it'll get up there after the break-in, I had a similar experience. But remember a couple of things.
1. People like to exaggerate their top end speed. Some might call it overcompensation. LOL
2. They do their speed tests with no extra weight in the boat, no gear, not much gas, etc.
Real life top end speed is never what people "clock" it at. Heck, how often can you do top speed on a lake anyway? I fish LSC all the time, and conditions rarely allow for me to be wide open without killing myself. In real life, we tend to run lower than top end most of the time. But I'm sure that rig's gonna kill it when the break-in is over. On those extra calm days, it's gonna be fun! ;D
I use to use Ring Free. Lately I use Merc. Quicklean. Works pretty well.
Mercury Quick Clean will help with ethonal? How often do you use it? Should I use it on the break in or wait untill the 10 hours is up?
Not to mention, don't get to hung up on speed. Seems like in touny's it's always the guy who is fishing on just the Trolling motor because blew an engine that do well. Makes them slow down and fish the water in front of you instead of blowing around the lake at 70mph...
I don't know about the top speed set-up for your rig but will say that the Mercury Quicksilver products are excellent. They have 3 "steps" but the first two are important here: Step 1 Quickare is for treating the ethanol in our gasoline, and Step 2 Quickleen is to help reduce/prevent carbon deposit build-up that result from the 2-cycle burn. Some think it's not a justified expense but who the heck said these rigs are cheap to run?
Just my 2 cents...
Scott
All good information. I am looking into purchasing the QuickSilver products now. What about applying wax to the bottom of the hull to help it glide across the water?
I have always been told not the wax the pad. You can wax the rest of the hull but if you wax back there it will create suction and actually slow you down. It sounds to me like you might need to raise your jackplate. Not sure if you have set it yet but I keep raising it until my water pressure drops when trimmed out and running, then drop it back down a notch. Do you know where it is set right now?
Is there a way to read the jackplate? I know when I am on it, the water pressure is up over 30. I checked both sides of the jackplate and did not see any markings on measurements. I must be missing it as it seems like it would be a must for those. Any idea where to check?
Tritons run best at around 3" below pad. Top speed on that rig in a lighten mode, little gas, no tackle, one person in boat you can break 70+. In real world mode 1/2 tank gas all your gear and a buddy next to you. 63-67 max depending on the load.
Run quickcare in every tank. Run quickleen twice a year or more. Run quickstore on your last tank of gas for the season.
I recommend an in line water separator / fuel filter to help with the ethanol and break down issues that caused the motor to blow.
Hope this helps.
If you have more questions about set-up call me at colony marine 248-371-0 four hundred.
You mention 99 and merc 200. If it is a 3L opti - 70 might be possible. With an EFI (2.5L) you won't ever be far above 65. Not sure if I have the years right, but I thought the TR20 was a 225hp rated boat which would push it into the low 70s.
It is a '99 Triton with a '99 Merc. 200 EFI.
Actualy the EFI's were slightly faster than the opti's in most cases. The PRo XS is a different story.
Quote from: Big dreams on August 31, 2011, 12:02:58 PM
Any idea where to check?
I hope it's O.K. with Dan to link to another board, but click here (http://www.bbcboards.net/zerothread?id=65514) to see an illustrated method for getting this measurement.
Quote from: Big dreams on August 28, 2011, 11:16:27 AM
When I did this, the top speed I can get to is 56 mph at 5500 rpm.
To me it seems I would at least get up to something close to 70. Any ideas?
I am certainly no expert, but it would seem that you should be turning more than 5500 R's. Might be a jack plate adjustment. When adjusting the depth of motor in the water, remember an 1/8 of an inch makes a huge difference.
I'm kinda thinking that once you start running normal after the break-in, things might pep up. If not, maybe you need to change your plugs. I did this immediately after the break-in on my motor and it made a huge difference.
Get it totally broken in first. Then see what it's got without all the extra oil etc. Then check your prop to pad as Bender suggested. What is the gear ratio on your LU? The slip calc even at a 2:1 gear ratio shows a 17%+ slip, more at a 1.75:1 or 1.87:1. And yes, a lot of guys post the max speed they have ever seen with no batts, no gear, and running on fumes. We all know that doesn't matter.
Matt
I am not sure what the lower unit gear ratio is. I will have to check into that. As far as plugs, what do you all prefer? I know there are a lot of different types/brands out there.
From what people post on their top speed, I was thinking the motor was not running correctly since there is a 15 mph difference but from what you all say, that is normal. Makes me feel better!
As others have said, your top end will get better as you break the motor in and start running the proper fuel mixture. I just finished the break in on my rebuilt 150 EFI and it's about 2-3 mph faster than it was just a couple weeks ago (at the beginning of the break in). First tank of straight fuel in it now. Smokes less too!!
As for pad height... 3" below is about right... you don't want that water pressure to fall below 10-12 PSI at wide open... or have the needle "bounce" when running top speed. You can experiment with the jack plate.... 1/8th inch at a time!!
According to all the tests I've seen, the best rated ethanol treatments are the Stabil Marine (looks blue in the bottle) or the Valvtect product (green bottle). Personally I run the Valvtect.
FYI: The only place in Michigan you can legally run over 55 mph is more than 1 mile offshore on the Great Lakes where speed is unlimited. Every else has a 55 mph speed limit unless posted lower. I'm seeing more 45 mph or lower limits posted each year.
I wasn't aware of speed limits on lakes. Makes sense I guess.
Yup. There are statewide legal speed limits in Michigan on the water. Every now and then I figure I better remind people.
45 MPH on Lake Fenton
45 MPH on Gull and Orchard, too.
Those speed limits are even enforced in the winter. I learned about them in 2000, when a buddy and I got stopped on our snowmobiles on lake Missaukee. Apparently, 100 is too fast. I have never had an issue on the water, but do realise that if they want, they could nail me.
As for top speed in the boat, I got 70.4 out of the Skeeter the other day on White Lake. I was alone, had all my gear, and 25 gallons of gas. As for the distance below the pad, I have no clue due to the fact that my indicator doesn't work for the jackplate. That kinda stinks, because I don't have a clue how to consistently run my boat on the top end.
I was on Wiggins Lake in Gladwin the other day. I have heard a lot of people talking about how it has big fish and no pressure. I figured I would hit it up before the NBAA and many local clubs start to fish it more next year. It is only a few hundred acres and when I was doing 50 + on it, I had a few people track me down and give me dirty looks after I stopped. Thanks for sharing DK! Saved my tail.
Well, some people just don't like flashy boats. I've never been on Wiggins but I've heard good things. I did notice when I got my bass boat that some people started treating me different but I just do my best to be courteous when I'm running my boat. I don't need to run everywhere by everyone on plane all the time such as when I'm in a constricted area. I still see a few boaters do some pretty careless things on small waters in the name of some local tournament that really doesn't mean a whole lot.
There are also rules about which direction to run around the lake - usually counter-clockwise, and you have to watch for local things like quiet hours and/or no wake times. These are catching on too because of jet skis and loud speed boats going crazy. I think conditions would be better if we had a mandatory license for boat drivers like we do for autos. Just too many people out there who don't have the faintest idea about courtesy, rules and proper navigation.
Though it does make the possibility of getting lots of entertaining video on some waters if the fish aren't biting...
Right on about entertaining video. But, have you ever just sat around a boat launch? Now that is entertainment.
As far as the rules about direction of travel and quiet times, those are kinda nice. That is one thing I like about Wolf Lake. No wake until 10, I think it is, and no wake after 7 pm. I love it, because you can get out there early and get 4 hours of quiet fishing in, and not use any gas.
Boat ramps are amazing entertainment. Wish I had video of a ton of it! We should probably have a boat ramps stories message board!
I believe all inland lakes are 55 unless posted otherwise. I asked a CO last year and thats what he told me. He did give me a funny look when I asked him though. :P
Maybe he thought it was odd anyone would want to go that fast? Don't know but I see some ridiculous, loud speed boats on inland lakes now. Used to be I rarely got passed by loud boats but it happens more often now.
I got caught in the middle of a loud, apparently annual race event of some type on Hardy Dam Pond a couple years ago where I was running my gas saving 45 mph when this big, loud boat decided he had to blow past me and chose to do so while running between me and some else who was running about 50 feet to my left. I really enjoyed having him skipping out the water, having trouble keeping his boat straight because he was overtrimmed, just so he could show me his was faster... phhhbbbbbbbttt! All I got to say to him.
Some of those boaters seemed reckless to me going from one end of the lake and back again over and over and over, turning a peaceful morning on a scenic lake into a loud, bad traffic day on any major highway near Detroit during rush hour. I hope to not go to Hardy anymore when they are there.
I have seen officers out on the water with a radar gun but very rare.
Quote from: Redbone on September 20, 2011, 02:03:52 PM
I believe all inland lakes are 55 unless posted otherwise. I asked a CO last year and thats what he told me. He did give me a funny look when I asked him though. :P
Yes. Statewide regulations in Michigan literally 55 mph on all waters except greater than 1 mile offshore on the Great Lakes where speed is unlimited, unless otherwise posted locally. Of course, there are standard and local no wake regulations too.
Did that weekend on Hardy happen to be the weekend after Labor Day? If so, that is the annual event that they call "Hot Boat Weekend". That is a weekend devoted to adult partying, and going as fast as your boat will allow. Not a good time to try to get any fishing done there. But, it is a good time if you have a box of Mardi Gras beads!
I am on my last partial fill of mixed gas and am just going over the 10 hour mark. I am fishing the Smallwood tourney this weekend and a possible run would be about 5 miles. If we do that run, I hope to see a little difference as it will have some normal fuel in there.
As for boat launch stories... Sometimes they are good unless you are waiting for them to get out of the way. When that happens, it becomes frustrating. Looking back though, I can laugh at a few lol.
Quote from: mikeszr800 on September 21, 2011, 05:05:01 AM
Did that weekend on Hardy happen to be the weekend after Labor Day? If so, that is the annual event that they call "Hot Boat Weekend". That is a weekend devoted to adult partying, and going as fast as your boat will allow. Not a good time to try to get any fishing done there. But, it is a good time if you have a box of Mardi Gras beads!
I'm not old enough yet to be allowed to do anything involving 'Mardi Gras' or 'beads' so I will take your word for it. Seems like someone told me they did it twice a year? That will be two weekends I don't want to be there. One minute, a beautiful bald eagle is soaring; the next ROAR!!!!! for the rest of the day...
Quote from: Big dreams on September 21, 2011, 06:10:37 PM
I am on my last partial fill of mixed gas and am just going over the 10 hour mark. I am fishing the Smallwood tourney this weekend and a possible run would be about 5 miles. If we do that run, I hope to see a little difference as it will have some normal fuel in there.
As for boat launch stories... Sometimes they are good unless you are waiting for them to get out of the way. When that happens, it becomes frustrating. Looking back though, I can laugh at a few lol.
I think I could write a book just about boat launches ;D
Good luck with the new trial run though Smallwood isn't the biggest lake for running a whole lot. I still haven't been there. Just going by the map where it looks like a smaller Secord. I hope the boat traffic isn't as heavy?
Quote from: djkimmel on September 21, 2011, 08:41:16 PM
Quote from: Big dreams on September 21, 2011, 06:10:37 PM
I am on my last partial fill of mixed gas and am just going over the 10 hour mark. I am fishing the Smallwood tourney this weekend and a possible run would be about 5 miles. If we do that run, I hope to see a little difference as it will have some normal fuel in there.
As for boat launch stories... Sometimes they are good unless you are waiting for them to get out of the way. When that happens, it becomes frustrating. Looking back though, I can laugh at a few lol.
I think I could write a book just about boat launches ;D
Good luck with the new trial run though Smallwood isn't the biggest lake for running a whole lot. I still haven't been there. Just going by the map where it looks like a smaller Secord. I hope the boat traffic isn't as heavy?
Smallwood is long and narrow. It is a much smaller lake than Secord. The only good thing is it isn't as deep so the weeds stop a lot of boat traffic once you get a little ways off the main river.
That should help then, fishing-wise anyways.
Here is an update to my top end speed. I was able to get it up to 60 with two people partially loaded with roughly 32 gal. of fuel. I still have hope that it will get an extra 5-10 mph for those early morning trips across the lake.
Hmmm i'm not an expert but that doesn't sound right. Something is off on that set-up.
Quote from: djkimmel on September 18, 2011, 04:40:43 PM
FYI: The only place in Michigan you can legally run over 55 mph is more than 1 mile offshore on the Great Lakes where speed is unlimited. Every else has a 55 mph speed limit unless posted lower. I'm seeing more 45 mph or lower limits posted each year.
I had no clue that was the case Dan. Not sure what I usually run at. I know it's more than your gas saving 45 if the water is nice. lol I'm guessing 55-65.
Quote from: mikeszr800 on September 18, 2011, 07:26:07 PM
Those speed limits are even enforced in the winter. I learned about them in 2000, when a buddy and I got stopped on our snowmobiles on lake Missaukee. Apparently, 100 is too fast. I have never had an issue on the water, but do realise that if they want, they could nail me.
As for top speed in the boat, I got 70.4 out of the Skeeter the other day on White Lake. I was alone, had all my gear, and 25 gallons of gas. As for the distance below the pad, I have no clue due to the fact that my indicator doesn't work for the jackplate. That kinda stinks, because I don't have a clue how to consistently run my boat on the top end.
How did the boat handle at that speed Mike?? I finally got gps this year, and was able to check my speed. I got it up to 70.2 one day this fall but I had to work my butt off to do it. Chinewalk was rough. Still think I have more in it because I don't think it ever got much over 5400-5500 rpms. I guess it's nice saying the boat goes that fast, but I'd rather drive slower and not have to fight (drive through) the chine.
My boat handles that speed really well. I am pretty comfortable with it. Didn't dance around anything like my Nitro did at 60. Some people say the boat should go faster than that. One member here, can't remember the name, has one with a 200 on it, and says his will do 72. There's a guy on BBC who claims his, which is identical to mine in every way, will do 77. That's even in his signature picture. I pm'd him to see how his boat is set up, prop pitch, where he runs the jackplate and so on. But, he never got back to me on that. But, 70.4 is moving right along, and when it's going that fast, the bow is WAY up in the air. That gets me kinda nervous.
You shouldn't drive your boat at a speed/trim that induces chine walk. Not safe. By the time you realize you have lost control, it will be too late to do anything about it. It happens in the blink of an eye that you can't take back.
Boating at high speeds is risky so please make sure you ALWAYS have a good life jacket on and your kill switch attached EVERY time. Make sure anyone else in the boat has a life jacket on too. I know people who have been involved in fatal or near fatal accidents that involved high speed. Most of the fatal ones became fatal due to not having the kill switch attached.
Sorry Dan, but saying you shouldn't drive at a speed or trim that produces chine is just wrong. Don't drive past your abilities. I could take you for a 74 mph run and you wouldn't think anything of it. I could let you drive and it could get ugly fast at 68 ish. If you can't drive your boat to PREVENT the chine from even happening, then don't push it. Boats that are set up right and getting fully up on pad will chine only if the driver doesn't make corrections to prevent it from starting. Some boats never lift that far. If you haven't learned to prevent the chine, find someone who has, they can teach you much quicker than you will learn solo. Never try to "drive through it", that leads to the type of bad things Dan is talking about.
Matt
Good information here. Many people think about speed and do not connect chinewalk with speed.
My Bass Cat Jag didn't chinewalk at the 70 mph plus mark once I got it propped and setup correctly.....My Puma hasn't had any issues up to 70 either...I haven't pushed her up to the High 70s to 80 mph mark yet but is sure did handle well in the low 70s...
I honestly think prop and setup will alleviate alot of chinewalk issues on quality hulls...
I have seen some good videos on correcting chinewalk.....If you do a search I am sure you can find something...
I will probably see the top speed on my Puma once....Just to say I did....I like the power to stay on top in the rough stuff but at my old age I don't feel the need for speed so much anymore.... ;D