I remember a couple years ago, seeing a Rogue rod that had these on it. It seemed to cut down on the weight pretty drastic. I am considering reconditioning a couple rods and wanted to see your thoughts. Here are my concerns, though. Will these damage your line? They dont really look that line friendly. Any thoughts. Good, Bad?
Heres a link to what I am thinking. http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?id=0043994319547a&navCount=0&podId=0043994&parentId=&masterpathid=&navAction=push&cmCat=&catalogCode=IJ&rid=&parentType=&indexId=&cmCat=netcon&cm_ven=netcon&cm_cat=N/A&cm_pla=N/A&cm_ite=netcon&hasJS=true (http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?id=0043994319547a&navCount=0&podId=0043994&parentId=&masterpathid=&navAction=push&cmCat=&catalogCode=IJ&rid=&parentType=&indexId=&cmCat=netcon&cm_ven=netcon&cm_cat=N/A&cm_pla=N/A&cm_ite=netcon&hasJS=true)
I have some good rods already, but this seems like a way to upgrade for a fraction of the cost of a new rod.
the only cons i have ever heard about these is:
1) they can have 'micro burrs' that can damage your line. I guess they are so small you cant see them or feel them with your fingers. But they can tear up mono or fluoro in a hurry.
2) they make a lot of noise with braid. Also, with heavier baits, they create a lot of vibration with braid taking away from the sensitivity of the rod.
If you want something that is tough enough to hold up to braid use, try the SiC or the new SiN guides. The weight difference cant be more than fractions of an ounce, can it?
McCarter himself :-\'
depending on what kind of guides on on there now, you will save some weight... i would look at the SIC/SIN guides also. Recoils are known to groove inside the eyes from using braid.
if you really want to save on weight, use Size A nylon wrapping thread and a low-build epoxy finish. (probably take 2-3 light coats).
What about just using them on 2 spinning rods that only see floro and light weight lures? These rods are 6 yrs old and could benefit the most from a recon.
Dude, it's titanium. It will hold up better and longer than any guide you put on it period. No ceramic to knock out or crack. If it hits something it goes right back to shape. It's lighter than any other guide on the market. Loomis puts these on the GLX series. Need I say more? If braid has to much feeling in it, that's because they are more sensitive than ceramic guides, SIC or not. Stop using braid then. Go with 30 lb. flouro or something, get more bites by them not seeing the line as well. Everyone will have something bad to say about something they are not using. Buy them, recondition your rods or have someone do them for you, and when you see the difference, ask someone to find a complaint then.
1Jav
Quote from: 1javelin on March 13, 2008, 12:56:26 PM
Dude, it's titanium. It will hold up better and longer than any guide you put on it period. No ceramic to knock out or crack. If it hits something it goes right back to shape. It's lighter than any other guide on the market. Loomis puts these on the GLX series. Need I say more? If braid has to much feeling in it, that's because they are more sensitive than ceramic guides, SIC or not. Stop using braid then. Go with 30 lb. flouro or something, get more bites by them not seeing the line as well. Everyone will have something bad to say about something they are not using. Buy them, recondition your rods or have someone do them for you, and when you see the difference, ask someone to find a complaint then.
1Jav
Your a little worked up today aren't ya 1jav!!!! Anything else you want to rant about!!?? ;D ;D
Your right a lot of companies are putting these guides on they're high end rods. Mainly I think do to cost and a little flash. I think these guides are still a little bit unproven. The only part that I would be concerned about it cooling. I don't know how well TI dissipates heat. I know one of the reason most guide are ceramic and aluminum is because of the good heat dissipation. The more heat to get away from the line the longer the line will last. Fluoro will burn and break very easy.
Cy
http://www.rodbuilding.org/read.php?2,248515,248515#msg-248515
http://www.rodbuilding.org/read.php?2,237294,237541#msg-237541
http://www.rodbuilding.org/read.php?2,218642,219953#msg-219953
some reading on the subject :)
The only real dealings I have had with Titanium is on valves in High performance 4 stroke engines....They are lighter, but they wear way faster than steel valves...Titanium is way softer than ceramic and will wear faster....Titanium is a strong light weight material, but it isn't known for it's ability to stand up to abrasian...We make sprockets out of titanium, but they have a steel insert for the teeth..Only the hub is titanium..
I would not use titanium in a guide...Just as the coments above stated if they had a Ceramic insert they would probably be great...
OK, maybe just one rod at first. You know though, I bet theres something wrong with my current guides also that I haven,t noticed that all of these other guys might have. If I dont like them, I guess I can put my old ones back on!
Josh,
Go ahead and use them! Every spinning rod I've built for the past 6 years has had Recoils on them and I've had no failures, or broken line due to guide problems. Every rod I've built for Greg Mangus (at least 30 in the past 5 years) has been built with Recoils. He fishes more than anyone should and he has yet to wear one out! They are most definitely the lightest, most sensitive guide you can use and the material is plenty hard enough and dissipates heat fast enough for fishing use. SIC, Alconite, and even Hardloy materials are overkill in terms of hardness, etc. I'd rather sacrifice a little "unnecessary material hardness" in return for dramatically reduced weight and increased sensitivity/balance anyday. We use mainly Fluorocarbon, but Clapper and Trombly have been using braid on a couple GLX's I built for them with Recoils and neither has had guide failure on these rods in over 2 years of hard use.
I've even convinced Charlie Terry and Ken Tucker that REC's are the way to go! LOL!!!! I'm currently re-wrapping a couple rods for CT now with REC's.
The only downside (if you want to call it that) is the sound of the line--because you can hear the coiled wire vibrating against each other when cast, and also the looks of the guides themselves. Neither of which are really a detriment to the improved performance of the rod.
Sold! I will keep you guys filled in on how they work.
Bare with me, I'm lazy and didn't look, but where do you find a matching tippet?
Whatever you do, don't use the Recoil tip tops! The line gets caught in the loop. I use the Fuji Chrome Framed Alconite tops model CFAT (less than $3.00 each). If you feel like spending money, get the Fuji TFST Titanium (~$8 each), but its not necessary. Both match the guide color well.
I bought the G Loomis BCFR894 GLX for flipping this past winter and I hope BryanP is right. Thats alot of $$ to be spending on a rod to have problems, i will be using braid on that rod too.
BryanP how do your prices for building custom rods on glx blanks compare to retail glx rods?
TCook, I just build for myself and a few buddies and don't do it as a business. That keeps me busy enough! If I built rods as a side business, I'd price them at or above what Loomis retails them for.
You won't have problems with the Recoils! Now I'm not saying they can't be broken, but they definitely withstand more abuse than standard guides.
Tcook,
Stackenem has a good friend that makes custom rods. I had a chance to meet him a couple of weeks ago and it sounds like he can make some of the higher end rods for less than what you can buy them for.
Nice guy! I didn't see any of his work, but you could ask Stack, I think he's got five or six of them.
The guy's name is Scott, he owns S.G. Custom Rods, phone number 248-396-3982
joshimoto son ;D
I've done a lot of repair for guys. The tip top is the area you really need to be concerned about. I've found that the TI tips seems to wear faster than the ceramic. I have also had a number of guys that bring in their rod and want all the guides changed to ceramic or to the TI, but the tip will be ceramic. I think the guides down the blank it doesn't matter, but the TI's do have the bounce back. Don't settle for the cheap tip, there are different grades of ceramic. The best ceramic tips run about $7.50 to the cheepest $2.50 (this isn't an add). Josh we can talk further Sat.
REEL MAN
OK!, so do I need to buy the reflex guides or are the Jann's flex things just as good. Also should I also relace the current tip or just leave it? Will it be unbalanced if I just leave it?
Jann's Flexlite guides are NOT as good! They're a cheap knockoff, regardless what they tell you. When they first got them, I went in to check them out and asked the guy if I could flex the frame. He said yes and I proceeded to flatten the guide and it did not spring back!
I would replace the tip if the ring size is bigger than the last guide. The Fuji CFAT and TFST tips I mentioned are small and compact. The one you have on the rod now might be bigger and look gaudy at the end of the rod compared to those tiny guides. The CFAT's are cheap enough I'd go ahead and put a new one on if it were me.
Bryan, click this link and then copy me the link to the tip you were referring to . If you would please.
I just had a rod built with the recoil guides and do not see how the line can get caught in the tip guide. The way the wire is bent makes this nearly impossible unless your slack line twists itself around your tip, which would be trouble anyways. Just my opinion though.
1Jav