What is made in the USA anymore? I thought the "All American" Johnny Morris would have his line in the USA but I am wrong! St. Croix has a few rods made in the USA but the bass rods are made in Mexico. Does anyone have any information on what is made in the USA? I sent Bass Pro an email stating they should have an American Flag next to product made in the USA. I doubt they will respond to my email. Let me know your thoughts!
Nemesis Baits are made in the USA. Matter of fact, they are made right here in Michigan.......by me! I make them in my garage while listening to Fleetwood Mac and Elvis Costello albums.
McCarter himself :-\'
Its hard to know what is realy made in the USA, my ford truck and my wifes navigator has made in mexico stickers on its parts....not real happy bout that!
Quote from: McCarter on February 09, 2010, 01:24:22 PM
Nemesis Baits are made in the USA. Matter of fact, they are made right here in Michigan.......by me! I make them in my garage while listening to Fleetwood Mac and Elvis Costello albums.
McCarter himself :-\'
I think I purchased some soft plastics from you at the Ultimate Fishing Show in Novi. I can't wait to get out there and start throwing them.
Quote from: skip johnson on February 09, 2010, 02:25:36 PM
Its hard to know what is realy made in the USA, my ford truck and my wifes navigator has made in mexico stickers on its parts....not real happy bout that!
Ford sold out years ago. They still have a few manufacturers in the states but not many. It is crazy how this world is changing so fast.
Grandt rods are made in the USA
I have been to the Grandt website. They seem to be nice rods. I know Ardent reels are made in the USA but they do not have many models to choose from. Plus the design is weird.
CJ
How does the balance, weight, and sensitivity of Grandt rods compare to other high end rods like Loomis, St croix exc? I know they are flashy but I could care less about the looks. What blanks and components do they use?
Madwags would be the one to ask technical questions about Grandt rods. I know they feel fantastic and are very sensitive. And the price for GLB members cant be beat. Lifetime warrantee, and made in the USA. Everything I'm looking for in a rod.
here is an interesting article about Boyd Ducketts new rod company. He tells why he has them made in China.
http://sports.espn.go.com/outdoors/bassmaster/news/story?page=b_blog_Duckett_2010
"we had to make a choice. We could stay in the U.S. and make high-end fishing rods that would cost American anglers considerably more money, or we could go where the manufacturing base is and make a high-quality rod that we can sell at a far more reasonable price."
from the link Steve posted. I don't know about most people but when I can I try to buy American. I might have considered one of his rods if they were made here and I'm generally willing to pay a bit extra for that. It's also for this reason that I stay out of Wal-Marx, I doubt you can find much of anything there made in U.S.A.
I actually am traveling to China soon myself and was really torn about the trip. One of my customers in the U.S. bought a machine and is having it shipped to a new plant in China. I talked to them about it and it is not taking work away from here and they are not moving anything over there, the new plant is just for them to branch out into the Far East market. And I believe this company when they say that. I don't have any problem with the people of China or any Asian country in particular, but their governments are another story.
I am afraid that it is a little too late though, driving through an industrial park in central Thailand a few years ago I saw all the big names: Ford, GM, Bendix, etc. and the aerospace company I was there to see who is another major U.S. name.
Grandt Industries is one of the largest fishing rod manufacturing facilities left here in the USA.
They manufacture finished rods for 67 other comnpanies. Some of you may own a Grandt manufactured product and do not know it. Most rods are made in the Tulsa plant but the custom and high end rods are made outside of Chicago.
Grandt Rods makes their own blanks.
The All AMERICAN and Golden Supreme models are built off of a 58 million modulus graphite blank that is built using a kevlar scrim cloth. The XLH70, Reserve Power, Stealth and other models are built off of a 78 million modulus graphite blank. This blank holds a patent and is the highest modulus graphite within the blank in the industry. The TiTech Titanium series is the only all Titanium blank on the market. The Stealth series uses a Titanium cloth wrap in the butt section of the rod. I personally tested this rod for 9 months prior to production, I can tell you there is nothing like it and nothing comes close to it in power to weight ratio.
Most rods blanks, even the most expensive on the market, do not exceed 56 million modulus in graphite. Grandt has perfected high modulus graphite rods and shafts. Their equipment is very high tech. They make awesome golf club shafts. As for components, some of the reel seats that have been designed by Jim Grandt are manufactured here in the USA but most components for fishing rods are made overseas. Most guides are made in Japan and are not cheap. Grandt buys from the source manufacturing facility. Grandt also uses PacBay components on its larger saltwater rods.
When you look in the booth and see the fancy wraps, that's all Jim Grandts personal hand work. That's what he does and he is good at it. We always get rod builders in the booth just staring in amazement. But that is not all they do. Grandts technology is second to none.
That is why I fish them.
Hope this helps. Feel free to ask any questions you wish.
Wags
It is depressing to think about but it needs to be addressed. I emailed many rod and reel manufacturers today about this issue. I just can't believe that Johnny Morris sold out on us! I feel cheated. At least Minn Kota is US based.
Actually aside from Fuji, most guides and reel seats are made in China or Korea. And I'm not so sure Fuji doesn't source them too.
Aren't Lamiglas rods made in the USA?
I thought that what I'd call the 'lower end" St. Croix rods, (Premier, Mojo Bass, Triumph, and a few others) were made in Mexico.
Also the Avids, legends, are still made here.
Quote from: Bender on February 09, 2010, 05:18:32 PM
I actually am traveling to China soon myself and was really torn about the trip.
I enjoy traveling to China (except for the long plane ride). Shanghai is a really nice town, easy to get around, clean - I like going there better than Europe.
We (GM) sell more cars in China than we do in the USA. It is the worlds largest auto market. We actually export many, many cars out of the USA to China, rather than the other way around. Pretty much all Cadillac nameplates, Lacrosse, ect are built here and sold there. Nice to see that for a change.
Seth
I am not sure. Kissler and GLoomis are I am told.
Quote from: Big dreams on February 10, 2010, 08:35:50 PM
I am not sure. Kissler and GLoomis are I am told.
Kistlers used to be made in the US. Now they are all made in China. Even the LTAs and LTX rods.
Quote from: jcheetam on February 10, 2010, 08:59:20 PM
Quote from: Big dreams on February 10, 2010, 08:35:50 PM
I am not sure. Kissler and GLoomis are I am told.
Kistlers used to be made in the US. Now they are all made in China. Even the LTAs and LTX rods.
I'm not sure about that
I know the IM7 that I bought from Kistler was made in China
But all the others say made in the USA
But I'll e-mail them and post what they have to say
If they are now made in China I've bought my last Kistler
I'll throw out McCoy line
There a Made in the USA product
Quote from: Manxfishing on February 10, 2010, 10:28:23 PM
Quote from: jcheetam on February 10, 2010, 08:59:20 PM
Quote from: Big dreams on February 10, 2010, 08:35:50 PM
I am not sure. Kissler and GLoomis are I am told.
Kistlers used to be made in the US. Now they are all made in China. Even the LTAs and LTX rods.
I'm not sure about that
I know the IM7 that I bought from Kistler was made in China
But all the others say made in the USA
But I'll e-mail them and post what they have to say
If they are now made in China I've bought my last Kistler
I'll throw out McCoy line
There a Made in the USA product
Used to be the LTA and LTX were made here. Not anymore...
Taken directly from their website:
"Unfortunately, we are not able to obtain all materials and components for these rods in the U.S., either because they are not available, or because economic or quality considerations dictate foreign sourcing. So therefore, our Helium LTX rods are "hand crafted" by our factory trained and experienced technicians at our partnering facility in China."
"The Helium LTA rods are designed, engineered and inspected at our shop in the USA, by Americans. Unfortunately, we are not able to obtain all materials and components for these rods in the U.S., either because they are not available, or because economic or quality considerations dictate foreign sourcing. So therefore, our Helium LTA rods are "hand crafted" by our factory trained and experienced technicians at our partnering facility in China."
I should say all current models are made in China. I don't know about the Z-Bone rod they will be coming out with. That may be assembled in the US.
I believe Falcon rods are still made in the U.S. too. I wish they had more dealers, I'm hunting for a specific one and can only find it at full retail price. Hopefully I'll come across a sale somewhere.
If the first number in a barcode starts with a "0" it is made in the USA.
Quote from: jcheetam on February 10, 2010, 10:50:30 PM
I should say all current models are made in China. I don't know about the Z-Bone rod they will be coming out with. That may be assembled in the US.
I've got a z-bone on order (I tried to convince them to name those t-bone but they didn't listen). The guy I talked to said he made the z-bone for Alton Jones and was excited to be able to see him fish with it in the upcoming classic. Now I don't know if that meant, I took his order over the phone or I put the components together. I'm assuming they are assembled in their U.S. shop and probably most of the components are foreign sourced.
Quote from: t-bone on February 11, 2010, 08:09:49 AM
Quote from: jcheetam on February 10, 2010, 10:50:30 PM
I should say all current models are made in China. I don't know about the Z-Bone rod they will be coming out with. That may be assembled in the US.
I've got a z-bone on order (I tried to convince them to name those t-bone but they didn't listen). The guy I talked to said he made the z-bone for Alton Jones and was excited to be able to see him fish with it in the upcoming classic. Now I don't know if that meant, I took his order over the phone or I put the components together. I'm assuming they are assembled in their U.S. shop and probably most of the components are foreign sourced.
The blanks are made by Gary Loomis' new company in the US. I'm guessing most of the other components are from overseas.
Where's them hot new four stroke yammies being made?
Sorry, just couldn't resist...;D
When you look at the reality of the world, it's darn hard to buy strictly US made products. Global outsourcing of nearly everything has lots of foreign made parts inside "US made" products.
At one time I owned an Isuzu Trooper. Had to use US wrenches to work on it, since there was a Buick V6 under the hood. Meanwhile my 95 Mustang has lots of metric fasteners. Makes it darn hard to take a stand when you really don't know what you're standing by.
I say we revolt; enough of this "litre" stuff, Cubic Inches rule!
Unless you ride a bicycle, you are buying foreign. Foreign products are sold in the US, by US employees. They still create jobs here. We are stuck with buying things from companies that are owned overseas. There are just as many foreign parts in a Harley nowdays as there are in a Yamaha, and Yamaha is put together in the states. How would it even be remotely possible to say you will NOT buy anything foreign? Its a great concept, but impossible.
I imagine myself in my Champion and I look around. I see all this nice shiny stuff. To my surprise, most of the nice shiny stuff comes from another country. At this point I would be surprised if my Champion was made here in the states. Pretty soon I am going to pull a bass out of the water with "Made in China" stamped on his forehead!
I haven't heard back from Kistler
But today I recieved 2 Kistler Mag. Alton Jones football jig rods
There's a sticker right on the bottom that say's made in China
Well at least I didn't pay retail for them
On the 3 Helium LTA rods that I do have
There is a sticker saying that there made in the USA
But they are the 08's ands 07's with the full cork grip
It's kind of funny thou
When I went with the Kistlers
2 of the main reasons were
one it was made in the USA and two they had a full grip
And today neither of those are true
Falcon was on the short list before and I'll be looking at the
Grandt rods next time.
I purchased a Grandt rod today! I called Jim up and it was a lot easier than I thought. I bought a 7' medium Eglass for cranking. It has a large mouth bass insignia on it. I think the price was close to $260 but with the Great Lakes Bass member discount (30%) it came to $159! That is an awesome deal! The unconditional warranty is worth that alone not to mention the USA quality. I will never buy another rod, it just isn't worth it to me. I was paying $169 for Johnny Morris Sig rods made in China. USA is the way to go boys.
BD,
Thank you for purchasing a Lifetime Grandt Product and supporting GreatLakesBass.com
I have that same rod and love it. This year it will be throwing a tournament winning custom painted C-Flash by Jeff Cheetam. I call it the twoeyeddeepdivecustompurplesmalliecatcher. :D
Quote from: Big dreams on February 11, 2010, 03:41:29 PM
I imagine myself in my Champion and I look around. I see all this nice shiny stuff. To my surprise, most of the nice shiny stuff comes from another country. At this point I would be surprised if my Champion was made here in the states. Pretty soon I am going to pull a bass out of the water with "Made in China" stamped on his forehead!
You could be right cause champion boats is mothballed, could be the end of a great boat, as for parts, rods etc. being made overseas, our goverment has let this happen, jobs and Co.'s moving out of the US for cheap labor,we have no fair trade, I do whatever I can to buy american as a retired Union member, I would rather keep an american working than a Chinese worker.
Quote from: MadWags on February 12, 2010, 06:43:58 AM
BD,
Thank you for purchasing a Lifetime Grandt Product and supporting GreatLakesBass.com
I have that same rod and love it. This year it will be throwing a tournament winning custom painted C-Flash by Jeff Cheetam. I call it the twoeyeddeepdivecustompurplesmalliecatcher. :D
I would like to see some Grandt rods, Is there a show coming up that they will be at ?
This is the next closest show.
Cleveland Sportsman Show
I X CENTER
March 18 thru 21
Cleveland, OH
Quote from: champion_206 on February 12, 2010, 08:47:07 AM
Quote from: Big dreams on February 11, 2010, 03:41:29 PM
I imagine myself in my Champion and I look around. I see all this nice shiny stuff. To my surprise, most of the nice shiny stuff comes from another country. At this point I would be surprised if my Champion was made here in the states. Pretty soon I am going to pull a bass out of the water with "Made in China" stamped on his forehead!
You could be right cause champion boats is mothballed, could be the end of a great boat, as for parts, rods etc. being made overseas, our goverment has let this happen, jobs and Co.'s moving out of the US for cheap labor,we have no fair trade, I do whatever I can to buy american as a retired Union member, I would rather keep an american working than a Chinese worker.
To my knowledge, the fate of Champion Boats has still not been decided.
Thanks to those of you who give Grandt a try. My last 4 rod purchases have all be Grandt.
I did not know Champion boats are on the edge. What is going on with them?
Champion Boats is part of the deal with the company - Platinum Equity - that bought a number of the Genmar brands during the bankruptcy sale including Ranger and Stratos.
All of Stratos manufacturing is moving to Flippin Arkansas. There's been no final public decision I'm aware of yet on the fate of Champion, which should mean anything is still possible.
Quote from: djkimmel on February 12, 2010, 11:51:15 PM
Champion Boats is part of the deal with the company - Platinum Equity - that bought a number of the Genmar brands during the bankruptcy sale including Ranger and Stratos.
All of Stratos manufacturing is moving to Flippin Arkansas. There's been no final public decision I'm aware of yet on the fate of Champion, which should mean anything is still possible.
And now that Hopper has Ranger and who has never been a fan of Champion, I can't even predict whats gonna happen, he aways has thought of champs as a threat to his ranger line, not sure he feels theres a market out there for so many bass boats anymore, and now that he has ranger and stratos selling at dealerships together, champion may be squeezed out, Don Wood is gone also, and Genmar has not spent much money in the last few yrs advertising champs, I can only hope champion is sold, and someone buys it and continues to build champs
The latest rumor is that Irwin Jacobs is poised to buy Champion.
Fact is, Champion sales have been on a steady decline since well before Genmar acquired them. They've never really been a strong brand anywhere except out west, and for a short time up here. They build a nice boat though.
Quote from: BryanP on February 13, 2010, 01:51:51 PM
The latest rumor is that Irwin Jacobs is poised to buy Champion.
Fact is, Champion sales have been on a steady decline since well before Genmar acquired them. They've never really been a strong brand anywhere except out west, and for a short time up here. They build a nice boat though.
With more advertising and good marketing,which champ has not had in a few yrs now, with the great rough water ride, there a great boat for the big water, if IJ get champ back, they will get more market share if its managed right
This is my first bass boat but my Champ is amazing! I do not see a need to switch brands just because mine is so good on the water. That is sad to hear that they could be finished!
And they could have a new beginning... no sense in worrying about it until you know you have something to worry about.
I realize it's not possible to buy everything we use made here in the U.S.A. That said, it is important to know where the profits go. I try to purchase from American owned companies whenever possible(better yet, Michigan based). I do everything that I can to purchase the everyday stuff from Meijer as opposed to Wally World, I try to purchase as much of my tackle locally as possible(sometimes not an easy task).
Question for the viewers
Q: Is it better to support American based companies even though they make their products out of the country?
or...
Is it better to support the American worker buy purchasing an American made product even though the company HQ is in another country?
I think the answer is, "What makes you feel comfortable with your purchases?" I personally prefer to purchase products made on US soil, by US workers. There used to be an argument about where the profits go, but now with the corporations effectively worldwide entities I don't think that is as strong.
I agree
I'd like to support American made products made in the USA
But I'm guilty of not buying some thing else because I felt comfortable buying it
I have a Yamaha on the back of the boat for the dependability
Like the Shimano's for the reason that I know what I'm buying
And just the other day I bought a couple Evergreen lipless baits
Because there isn't a USA silent lipless bait out there
But for Rods
I can tell you I won't be buying a China made 200 dollar plus Kistler
Love the rods I do have, But that there is just pure greed
What I find interesting is the perception that just because a product is made in China, it's pure profit. I'm curious how you come to that assumption and how some people seem to be so sure that's the case. I have a friend who always seems to think he knows when a company is "making too much money"! He has absolutely no basis for his assumption since there is no way of knowing for sure how much it costs company X to manufacture, market, and service product Y unless you are directly involved. He's even suggested the government should regulate how much profit a company should make, which is scary! :o
In my job, I am involved with lots of different manufacturers, some of which manufacture 100% in the US, some partially, and others who manufacture overseas. The main thing that dictates country of origin is the ability for produce a product at a cost people will want to pay, while still being able to maintain a profit margin sufficient to run the company. If you can't be competitive in price, you're not going to get people to buy your product, and if you aren't making money, you aren't going to be in business very long.
I guess a question to ask is this:
If a rod sells for $200, how much of that $200 is fair profit for the manufacturer, and also for the dealer? Then ask yourself if that would be enough profit for you to run your business.
For some reason the edit function doesn't seem to be working. Post should read "He has absolutely no basis for his assumption...."
**deleted**
Here are two examples of why the market has gone over seas. I know of a business that was coming out with an new product. They tried their best to have it made hear in America. What they found was only one manufacture that could do it. It would have cost retail around $300 when it was complete. Over seas with the same mechanical parts it costs around $80 retail. NO WAY would anyone buy a new product on the market for $300 when everyone else is selling similar things for less than $100. I dont care what you say. And yes this is in the fishing industry.
In a similar instance another friend has been selling his product for $1 a piece for years. He had a chance to replace one part of it for .10 cents more if he would buy American. Doesn't sound like alot so why didnt he. He is an American business owner trying to make money at what he does like the rest of us. He sells about 250 thousand of these a year. If he would have increased his product his sales probably would have gone down, but if not HE would of lost $25,000 for switching to this other part. That could be the difference between the business making it or not. You cant blame him for his decision at all.
If we as Americans would stop wanting $20 an hour for screwing in 6 screws ever 15 minutes or $20 an hour for sweeping up a room and get back to getting payed what the job is worth them maybe things in this country would actually become affordable. Now let me make it clear that I think that foreign workers are underpayed. But I also think we have overpaid our employees out of their jobs and that is why everything is being made somewhere else.
I too like to buy American when I can, but I don't make alot of money and I am unemployed right now. So when I do buy something that looks and feels roughly the same and has a warranty roughly the same no matter whether it is in the fishing industry or not I am going to by the cheapest that I can get away with roughly the same quality if I can find it. I think most Americans are in this same boat right now but hopefully some day I wont have to worry about my pennies.
I would go into why I think that this is the reason but that will just bring up a huge argument about unions, prevailing wages, etc. So I wont.
LOL I just got that McCarter!
I think I need to hire a better word censor...
At first I thought McCarter was just stating the obvious and calling me a small donkey! ;D
Quote from: BryanP on February 17, 2010, 10:30:21 AM
I guess a question to ask is this:
If a rod sells for $200, how much of that $200 is fair profit for the manufacturer, and also for the dealer? Then ask yourself if that would be enough profit for you to run your business.
Really, if I had to guess
I'd say the mark up the Helium rod is 160% over cost now
I'm guessing 60-80 for mat'l (rod seat, guides and blank)
and then labor in the USA (80) or China (10)
The problem i have is
The Helium rods were made in the USA and they listed for 249
Now there made in China 2 years later and there 269
(same rod seat, guides and blank)
Hey, it's all about profit margin. Forget the nice guy thing. And if it is a publicly traded company add the allegiance to the stockholders. Which by the way fuel your 401K (which I believe had a profound effect on where we are as a nation today).
If your margin can increase by 50% isn't that capitalism in all it's glory?
I can see where everyone is coming from. Being in the Information/Computer Security field, I can see where a business would want max profits with the smallest overhead, that makes sense to me. I can also understand that the American worker is getting over paid to work that any American with a high school diploma can do. With the raise in minimum wage, the prices of everyday goods are going to climb. I see the signs about "Buy American" and I look immediately to my passion. Most of the products in my box and in my boat are made outside of the U.S. Just a little frustrated I guess...
Understand the feeling... just do your best with what makes you feel comfortable. I think many people do the same.
Getting out good and accurate information to everyone to help make decisions based on that is one of the main reasons I started this site. Way too much disinformation out there.
Quote from: Manxfishing on February 18, 2010, 05:53:53 AM
Quote from: BryanP on February 17, 2010, 10:30:21 AM
I guess a question to ask is this:
If a rod sells for $200, how much of that $200 is fair profit for the manufacturer, and also for the dealer? Then ask yourself if that would be enough profit for you to run your business.
Really, if I had to guess
I'd say the mark up the Helium rod is 160% over cost now
I'm guessing 60-80 for mat'l (rod seat, guides and blank)
and then labor in the USA (80) or China (10)
The problem i have is
The Helium rods were made in the USA and they listed for 249
Now there made in China 2 years later and there 269
(same rod seat, guides and blank)
I think you'd be surprised how low the mark up really is on a lot of the fishing products we buy.
I just came across this today and found it really interesting. It makes me consider St.Croix a lot more.
Part 1 Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZ68GhHWBS0
Part 2 Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JP-F0WVwciQ
Quote from: BryanP on February 17, 2010, 04:02:10 PM
At first I thought McCarter was just stating the obvious and calling me a small donkey! ;D
when i ready your post, the word assumption read b-e-h-i-n-dumption so i just wanted to see what would happen if i posted the word aye ess ess.
its the little things that entertain me the most ::)
McCarter himself :-\'
Great topic...reminds me of the bumper sticker: Out of a job yet? Keep buying foreign
Xtreme Bass Tackle - Also USA made